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Cloaked droids
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HR-Mickey
Cloverfield Monster


Joined: 24 Nov 2002
Posts: 1844
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:13 pm    Post subject:
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Apatheticloser wrote:
pardon.. Psysic sight can be avoided how? oh yea.. the same exact ways a droid can.


Pardon, two glaring differences:

1. Psychic sight offers a resisted mental roll to let the person being located avoid it, and the located character has a chance to know it was attempted. A cloaked droid affords no such roll, makes no messaging, and they don't know it's there unless they decide to search.
2. Psychic sight is a single snapshot of the room/location; an everpresent droid, on the other hand, keeps a perpetual watch and monitors activity. Furthermore, it does so without means to physically remove or prevent it.

Let's not argue apples and oranges, especially when the apples hurt your case more than help it.
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Tylen
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Joined: 29 Jul 2003
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:47 pm    Post subject:
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Kit wrote:
No, it was part of an RP with Faith's two NPCs...who were interacting reguarding the drug trade...and it did have potential to be an awesome RP.


Sorry but RP, no matter how absolutely utterly fantastic, doesn't justify everything.
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Kit
Cybertech Extraordinaire~


Joined: 31 Aug 2004
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:59 pm    Post subject:
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The apples of the matter is...a droid cloaks for roughly a minute. There's almost nothing that can happen in that period of time to warrant anyone at all searching it out. It was unfair of you not to set a limit on it. Crippling something because you don't like it or it annoys you isn't right. If you did it reasonably, there'd be no problem. In fact, when I saw the announcement, I was very much in the 'pro' catagory...even when everyone started to be OOC about it on thoughts when we're told not to react IG to IG announcements.

That's besides the point though. It's not like a 20th level character can search out a 100th level tech's droid...it's that a fresh from the CM character can. You pretty much made the system obsolete....and wouldn't it be Drake's place to do that? I'm not trying to start a fight, but what you did was rather unfair.
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Kit
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Joined: 31 Aug 2004
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:00 pm    Post subject:
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Tylen wrote:
Kit wrote:
No, it was part of an RP with Faith's two NPCs...who were interacting reguarding the drug trade...and it did have potential to be an awesome RP.


Sorry but RP, no matter how absolutely utterly fantastic, doesn't justify everything.


The GM in question knew I was doing it. At the time, she was having connectivity issues to boot...so it never came of anything. But it was fine RP, thank you. And 'espionage' mode is for espionage. Hate to break it to you.
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HR-Mickey
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Joined: 24 Nov 2002
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:19 pm    Post subject:
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Kit wrote:
That's besides the point though. It's not like a 20th level character can search out a 100th level tech's droid...it's that a fresh from the CM character can. You pretty much made the system obsolete....and wouldn't it be Drake's place to do that? I'm not trying to start a fight, but what you did was rather unfair.


Actually, Drake and I went over it this afternoon. He's going to make changes of his own accord, I'll be making similar, and in the end everything will be made fair for any possible parties involved in a given situation involving droids, locating and stealth; so everybody is happy.
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Mickey Brunner

To make a long story short, don't tell it.

I may be going nowhere, but I'm going nowhere fast.
---
Kelvin Watt says, "I stopped drinking coke when no longer drinking beer didn't make my gut disappear."
---
Kaelin Rae says, "Wait a minute..."
Kaelin Rae says, "You mean they have a COKE machine that dispenses beer."
Kaelin Rae nods to you.
Kaelin Rae says, "Greaser."
Kaelin Rae looks at you and sighs.
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Kit
Cybertech Extraordinaire~


Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 3071
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:20 pm    Post subject:
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HR-Mickey wrote:
Kit wrote:
That's besides the point though. It's not like a 20th level character can search out a 100th level tech's droid...it's that a fresh from the CM character can. You pretty much made the system obsolete....and wouldn't it be Drake's place to do that? I'm not trying to start a fight, but what you did was rather unfair.


Actually, Drake and I went over it this afternoon. He's going to make changes of his own accord, I'll be making similar, and in the end everything will be made fair for any possible parties involved in a given situation involving droids, locating and stealth; so everybody is happy.


Thank you, that's all I was asking. ^.^
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HR-Mickey
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Joined: 24 Nov 2002
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:31 pm    Post subject:
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Just following up...

Quote:
There's almost nothing that can happen in that period of time to warrant anyone at all searching it out. It was unfair of you not to set a limit on it.


If the droid cloaking period is so complainably short and innocuous, then the search change, in my eyes, is trivial at best in the first place (not to mention, if nothing can happen, then indeed there's no cause for searching). Whether a 1st level or 150th level character searches it out, nothing actually happens. The droid still stays present at the whim of the tech, and the root issue still exists. This, in effect, makes the term "unfair" pretty subjective. For instance, I think a PC having to tolerate a lurking droid in what should be a private vault room is pretty "unfair". Likewise, I (then and now) feel that a 10th level technician with an unfettered means to track 100th level characters is darned tritely unfair, too. My change has been in effect for approximately a day, while the locating-at-will has existed for as long as players have had droids.
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Mickey Brunner

To make a long story short, don't tell it.

I may be going nowhere, but I'm going nowhere fast.
---
Kelvin Watt says, "I stopped drinking coke when no longer drinking beer didn't make my gut disappear."
---
Kaelin Rae says, "Wait a minute..."
Kaelin Rae says, "You mean they have a COKE machine that dispenses beer."
Kaelin Rae nods to you.
Kaelin Rae says, "Greaser."
Kaelin Rae looks at you and sighs.
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HR-Drake
Machine King


Joined: 06 Sep 2002
Posts: 465
Location: Gadget Hell

 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 4:21 pm    Post subject:
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HR-Mickey wrote:
the locating-at-will has existed for as long as players have had droids.


But not for long! Bwahahahah

And I apologize, but only a little. I should have gone through all of the droid stuff and made appropriate changes ages ago, but up until now the droid locate-at-will hadn't been abused to this extent. So blame it on the abusers for getting it nerfed.
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Kit
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 4:52 pm    Post subject:
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Locating at will was not so much the issue. All the 'affected' player has to do is hide...and droid is gone. Even if they unhide and move, the droid will not follow them.

So what about the search? Can anyone still find a hidden droid? That's my huge beef.

And please go into more detail about a 'droid's skill.'

Also: What if the other person WANTS to be found? I've used Beast lots of times to remotely fix things for people. Does this mean I can no longer do this for anyone of decent skill?
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HR-Drake
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:00 pm    Post subject:
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Mickey is going to modify SEARCH, so I assume not everyone will be able to find a hidden droid, but we'll wait for his response.

What I meant by a 'droid's skill' is its skill in espionage, but its internal components also play a factor. Huge droids like a MAD take a hit to their espionage skill given the fact that they're so huge and noisy.. smaller droids like the air drone and another planned droid have a bonus to their espionage skill, since they're smaller and quiet.

Hacking a droid will never negate the penalty, but it can lessen it.
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Kit
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:08 pm    Post subject:
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So getting the THz Lava processer actually helps then?

...


This is ridiculous.

I can't finda 40th level character two rooms away. There's almost no reason for me to have a GPS on my droid at this rate...and the cloaking device is meaningless. I'm sorry for being upset...but I am. Droids are just becoming more and more worthless.... Oh well. I won't be able to find dead bodies anymore. ^.^


Edit: My limit is 30 it seems for findablility.
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Tugor
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Joined: 18 Oct 2003
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:16 pm    Post subject:
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HR-Mickey wrote:
1. Psychic sight offers a resisted mental roll to let the person being located avoid it, and the located character has a chance to know it was attempted. A cloaked droid affords no such roll, makes no messaging, and they don't know it's there unless they decide to search.


Really? Someone can actually RESIST being located? I've never seen nor heard of that ever happening. Or is the messaging for a resist the same as the messaging when attempted to locate someone hidden? Or is the same messaging as when you attempt to locate someone in a non-locatable area? I'd assume it would be the latter, if so that's pretty nifty.
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HR-Drake
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:20 pm    Post subject:
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Level plays only a small part in finding the person. I could tell you guys everything that plays a role now in using a droid's GPS to find someone, but that spoils the fun in testing it out.

BTW Kit, you can't expect a MAD to be that great when it comes to finding people, it has a big penalty to espionage, considering its size and how noisy they are. They're combat machines, remember.
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soundless
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:27 pm    Post subject:
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is there a difference between a droid finding someone and a droid hiding from someone?

i can see massive droids finding people, but it being near impossible to hide.

also, is the finding part just based on the droid or can people resist it?
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Kit
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 Post Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:33 pm    Post subject:
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They have a GPS unit...for someone standing outside...in the open...they should be pretty easy to find actually. But no matter, I'm not going to bother with it anymore. I'll keep Beast for myself. No more going to medics for a first aid or medicine boost, or alchemists for alchemy boosts. Doing that to the GPS system hurts more than helps. Dixie and Morgana both benefit from Beast time and time again.
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