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Tracker = Bounty Hunter!!!
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senutyenool



Joined: 03 Dec 2002
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 7:05 pm    Post subject: Tracker = Bounty Hunter!!!
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::dons his anti matter suit for maximum protection from the Merc onslaught::

Okay, I've nearly read these forums from end to end and must say I'm somewhat peeved at the non-sensical application of Bounty Hunter status to the Mercs.

Sorry, but a merc is a hired gun/killer working for the highest bidder to fight someone elses battle (Yes I do understand the role of a true merc, being ex-military with 20 years service) and does not go around chasing bad guys for money.

A bounty hunter is a person who chases down ( tracks ::hint hint:: ) said bad guys for monetary gain, keeping out of the firing line (merc area) as much as possible. I take it no-one here has heard the saying 'Dead or Alive'? Wink

Ergo, I believe that a Tracker would be more fitting as a Bounty Hunter then a merc would ( waits for the BTG to zap him with his ACME Triple Redundant Phaszoomatronimic Blaster ::cringe:: )
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HR-Jocelyn



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 8:02 pm    Post subject:
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Mercenaries are hired fighters. Whether they're hired to fight a battle, or hired to assasinate someone, or hunt someone down, they're main concern is pay. Whatever job pays well and isnt suicidal, chances are a Merc will take it. I think bounty hunting fits in perfectly to this profile of a Mercenary. But then again, I'm just a doctor, what do i know!? Wink

~ Joce, Medic guru
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HR-Trevor
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Joined: 04 Oct 2002
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 8:15 pm    Post subject:
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I think there are other aspects you have to consider here.

Yes, a Tracker would spin circles around a Mercenary in the wild, and can track down people efficiently, and is quite well equipped in combat.

However, think about the dynamics of bounty hunting in Haelrahv. To be a bounty hunter in the frame being discussed, a Tracker would need to deal with constant bureaucracy and the hassle of law enforcement. They'd have to deal with red tape and spending half their time in cities to get contracts and claim rewards.

Even if a Tracker has no qualms about hiring himself out for pay, the dynamics of the situation don't fit the Tracker profile. A Tracker is more likely to hunt down a poacher, or someone damaging the area they mainly reside in, or protect the wilds and their friends/fellow Trackers. Then also consider that as many or more bounties would be on people who are in the cities -- places Trackers are not nearly as able to work in.

Now, the Mercenary is another story. He's not as adept in the wilds, but he's comfortable for the most part being anywhere... city, wilds, whatever. He's most used to the city, but has to travel enough to be fairly seasoned outside of it. He has no qualms about tracking someone down for a paycheck, and he's pretty well versed in it. He isn't adept in tracking itself, nor as streetwise as an Agent, but he's a well rounded killing machine. The fact he can kill doesn't make him a bloodthirsty savage.. these aren't barbarians in a bloodthirsty berserk state.

The ability to have trained dogs only adds to their ability. What the Merc lacks in tracking ability, he can compensate for somewhat with the use of his dog. Overall, the Merc profession is a combatitive bunch, yes. They excel in offensive power over every other profession. But that doesn't mean they can't grab a contract and bring em back without ripping the guy to shreds.

Hey, is Boba Fett a Tracker or a Merc? If I had to pick one or the other, I'd say a Merc. I never saw him poking around in the woods, and he has all the high tech gadgets and weaponry.

Anyway, all of this aside, Trackers are far from lacking, and adding bounty hunting would really give them too much, IMO. They're the supreme masters of the wild. They can train animals and handle them like no other, and they are exceptionally well versed with traditional firearms and bows, and resourceful enough to do well in some of the harshest situations.

For Mercs, bounty hunting gives them something to do that is a little less combatitive than slaying beasts all day, and it gives them an alternate source of income and experience. I think it balances out well.
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senutyenool



Joined: 03 Dec 2002
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 8:16 pm    Post subject:
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HR-Jocelyn wrote:
Mercenaries are hired fighters. Whether they're hired to fight a battle, or hired to assasinate someone, or hunt someone down, they're main concern is pay. Whatever job pays well and isnt suicidal, chances are a Merc will take it. I think bounty hunting fits in perfectly to this profile of a Mercenary. But then again, I'm just a doctor, what do i know!? Wink

~ Joce, Medic guru


Let me slice apart your reasoning, Oh Medic Guru ::pun intend, snickers:: Laughing

Mercenaries are hired fighters = Correct on all fronts.
Hired to fight battles = Correct on all fronts (Woohoo batting 100/100)
Hired to assissinate = Wrong! Agent (ergo assassin) type skill.
Hired to hunt someone down = Wrong! Hunting someone would either be an Assassins (Agent) or Trackers job. In tracking (hunting) someone down you may not necessarily wish to confront them when you have found them. Not all bounty hunters arrest (for want of a better word) their targets, but may refer their whereabouts to the local authorities and collect the reward from information given and subsequent capture.

The above is not meant to be inflammatory, but are just my opinions (after some research) about the difference between a mercenary and a tracker (bounty hunter) in our current society, which naturally is (although mainly a guess) how most other people define the difference between the two professions.

So take note BTG and give us trackers back our Bounty Hunter title ::ducks in abject fear of being vaporised::
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senutyenool



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 8:46 pm    Post subject:
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HR-Trevor wrote:
I think there are other aspects you have to consider here.

Yes, a Tracker would spin circles around a Mercenary in the wild, and can track down people efficiently, and is quite well equipped in combat.

However, think about the dynamics of bounty hunting in Haelrahv. To be a bounty hunter in the frame being discussed, a Tracker would need to deal with constant bureaucracy and the hassle of law enforcement. They'd have to deal with red tape and spending half their time in cities to get contracts and claim rewards.

...... shortened to preserve sanity Very Happy .


Whoa, quick on the trigger there BTG Laughing

Hmm, after reading your definition of a tracker I have come to the conclusion that they're not going to be much more than glorified gardeners with combat skills and an affinity to wildlife. ::sighs dramatically::

I am still of the believe that a Mercenary, per se, is as everyone has said so far, just a hired gun. A Merc will not go out of his way to spend the time and effort required to track/hunt someone down who is actively trying to avoid being captured/apprehended.

It would take too much time and effort (and usually for only a small monetary gain - with a minimal risk of life lose depending on ones skills) to find someone (track/trace/hunt down) as opposed to hiring out to fight battles/wars (for a significantly larger monetary gain - although decidely more prone to losing ones life).

As for assassinations, these are more the works of a stealthy individual who spends an ordinarily large amount of time making sure that everything is just perfect before carrying out the hit. Once again for a large monetary gain with minimal (if not any) risk of lose of life. Ergo my thinking an agents type of profession/skill.

Oh well, if it be that mercs stay as bounty hunters I will have to change my primary choice from tracker to merc ::mutters and walks off kicking at the ground in abject misery::
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 9:25 pm    Post subject:
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I guess the best way to summarize this is, if bounty hunting is your primary goal, yes, I think Mercs are the choice for you.

But, I do have to defend Trackers. They're far more than glorified gardeners with some combat skills. A few points of note:

- Trackers have more triple-trainable skills than any other profession, which is not a distinct edge, but it does convey their versatility as a class.

- Trackers are, as you said, great "gardeners"... they are the best foragers. This is an incredibly helpful skill as poisons and alchemical solutions require these components.

- In the wilds, the Tracker has the ability to scout and track down prey, as well as cover their own tracks.

- Trackers can train and tame animals, and ride mounts with more skill than others.

- Trackers excel in skinning, tanning, woodworking, swimming, climbing, fishing and athletics.

- Trackers are exceptional with bows and firearms.

In other words, this is more or less your core Ranger profession. I don't know if it's more of a case that you didn't realize they were this nature-oriented, or not, but they certainly aren't just glorified gardeners. In fact, they excel in a more diverse skillset than any other profession in the list, probably. Their only point of focus is the affinity to nature ... their skills themselves are very diverse and they are able to do a great number of things well.

BTW, I also disagree that bounty hunting would be less profitable or desirable to a Merc, but this really just breaks down to a difference of opinions, and I understand your stance even though I don't agree with it.

In essence, if bounty hunting is your prime goal, then you'll have to be a Merc. But you may find that some of the aspects you like about the bounty hunter character can be played out under one of many available classes including the Merc, the Tracker and the Agent.
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senutyenool



Joined: 03 Dec 2002
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 10:01 pm    Post subject:
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Hmm, okay, after reading your description/definition of a Tracker I hereby admit defeat and will don the Tracker Mantle. (heh and thanks for the quick and succinct replies)

Beware you bad guy types though. If the price is right your hide is mine....... ( that is if it's more than 0 you're worth nailing to the wall ::snickers:: )
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Raven



Joined: 05 Sep 2002
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2002 10:40 pm    Post subject:
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Well look who just strolled into the Tracker Forums!

*kicks a furry woodland creature out of her way*

I'm taking a little vacation here of undetermined length, but trying to keep up with the doings and goings in Hael (The number one rated online RPG, by me!) and this whole line of thinking has gone sideways with me.

First of all, to call Trackers glorified gardeners after the extreme amount of heart and work that Ragnar has put into making them fantastic is more than just a little offensive. As Boss has pointed out, they have some really excellent systems in place that are going to set them apart as far as fun and playability (is that a word?). In fact it was with Trackers in mind, wanting to work closely with what I know is going to be a great group, that the idea for Merc companions was put forth.

The outlines for bounty hunting were developed and presented by Phoenix and myself when I first took on the Mercenaries, and it was with no disagreement among the other developers that it was made Merc only. Every group is going to need their niche, and this was the most sensible one for us to take as far as working out a cool extra-curricular activity for the profession.

As for your opinion that only a Tracker would have the will to search for someone that was wanted, well ... Twisted Evil where there's money there's a will. This, according to your definition of what a Tracker and Mercenary is, makes perfect sense. And if you want to talk about how things work in the real world, moot point but I don't believe that modern-day bounty hunters crawl around in the woods looking for footprints and blood trails.

Sorry to disappoint you, but all of this has already been planned, gone over and had a stamp of approval put on it. There's really no use in sitting around writing about how no one working on Hael seems to understand the difference between professions. I've been there, worked with them and I can guarantee you're not gonna easily find a more creative, dedicated group who are willing to put so much time into researching and striving to make a place enjoyable.

In your choice of characters, go where you will, but leave your attitude of disappointment behind. If you consider either Mercenaries or Trackers to be second rate because you can't have everything you want in one shot, it'd be a sight better to have you in another profession anyway.

The Mage building is that'a'way *points*

Raven
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Raven



Joined: 05 Sep 2002
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 Post Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2002 1:27 pm    Post subject:
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Err.. hey! No fair giving up right before I hit the "submit" button! Now I gotta be a sport and show my agreeable side.

*checks high and low*

I've got one somewhere.

Raven

Massing an army at the border of a deserted country. *grunts*
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senutyenool



Joined: 03 Dec 2002
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 Post Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2002 4:59 pm    Post subject:
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Raven wrote:
Well look who just strolled into the Tracker Forums!

*kicks a furry woodland creature out of her way*

I'm taking a little vacation here of undetermined length, but trying to keep up with the doings and goings in Hael (The number one rated online RPG, by me!) and this whole line of thinking has gone sideways with me.

First of all, to call Trackers glorified gardeners after the extreme amount of heart and work that Ragnar has put into making them fantastic is more than just a little offensive. As Boss has pointed out, they have some really excellent systems in place that are going to set them apart as far as fun and playability (is that a word?). In fact it was with Trackers in mind, wanting to work closely with what I know is going to be a great group, that the idea for Merc companions was put forth.

The outlines for bounty hunting were developed and presented by Phoenix and myself when I first took on the Mercenaries, and it was with no disagreement among the other developers that it was made Merc only. Every group is going to need their niche, and this was the most sensible one for us to take as far as working out a cool extra-curricular activity for the profession.

As for your opinion that only a Tracker would have the will to search for someone that was wanted, well ... Twisted Evil where there's money there's a will. This, according to your definition of what a Tracker and Mercenary is, makes perfect sense. And if you want to talk about how things work in the real world, moot point but I don't believe that modern-day bounty hunters crawl around in the woods looking for footprints and blood trails.

Sorry to disappoint you, but all of this has already been planned, gone over and had a stamp of approval put on it. There's really no use in sitting around writing about how no one working on Hael seems to understand the difference between professions. I've been there, worked with them and I can guarantee you're not gonna easily find a more creative, dedicated group who are willing to put so much time into researching and striving to make a place enjoyable.

In your choice of characters, go where you will, but leave your attitude of disappointment behind. If you consider either Mercenaries or Trackers to be second rate because you can't have everything you want in one shot, it'd be a sight better to have you in another profession anyway.

The Mage building is that'a'way *points*

Raven


Woohoo, lucky I was wearing my anti matter suit of uber protection or that woulda fried the nose hairs right outta my head Razz ......

Okay, mayhaps I didn't make myself too clear about what I was after (and probably came off sounding a bit harsh which was not my intent at all - hate it when you can't convey the tone behind the message and for most of it, it was meant as tongue in cheek).

I (that is me, myself and I - the three of us) tended to see the merc as a killing machine straight out with no refinements. In a nutshell 'Kill first, ask questions later.' Whilst the erstwhile tracker, by using his more outdoorsy skills, would achieve the same aim but with a little more finesse.

When I first stumbled across this site, I read the majority of the subjects (including professions) before joining this forum and had already decided that a Tracker's life is the one for me and did not mean to demean the amount of work that people have put into this in any shape or form. My real aim was to get the title of Bounty Hunter for Trackers, but alas, that's now been summarily shot down in flames by the BTG ::all hail the BTG - grovels in abject admiration:: Cool

So my apologies to all whom were offended, but it was not an intentional jibe at any one person or any ones work. Embarassed

Okay, keep moving, nothing here to see.
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Nojym



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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2002 1:51 am    Post subject:
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Yeah, I'm still here. Just gotta point out that either Senut and I will get along in a bad way Twisted Evil or all hell is gonna break loose. Course, I might welcome the competition. Tends to make one strive a lil more. Just don't get on the damage end *mwahahahahaha*
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senutyenool



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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2002 6:52 am    Post subject:
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Hrmmmmm, lemme quote my all time hero, DUCK DODGERS Of The 24TH And A Half Century: "Thith planet ain't big enough for the bothhh of us" (wipes copious amount of spit off his screen)

I can see a real nice love hate scenario beginning here Cool. Oh and ya gotta see me before you can nail me (insert evil laughter right about here Arrow )
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Dante
Boi Toi


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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2002 11:06 am    Post subject:
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Confused

Ooohhh, boy...your guys' relationship is going to be an interesting one to watch from the sidelines. So where can I get some popcorn for this?
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HR-Mickey
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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2002 6:27 pm    Post subject:
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I'd like to point out that good roleplaying (and a bit of planning) should allow you to convey whatever form of in-game "occupation" (for lack of a better word) you desire. Imagine the innocuous performer that discretely slips a sleep-inducing toxin into your food or drink, all the while carousing you.
And to stir up the statistical mix, I direct your attention to other prime find-and-retrieve-the-target mancatchers: mages and psionicists who wield their respective powers to locate and subdue the elusive quarry and teleport back with relative safety, and technicians who specialize in subterfuge and trap-type technology.
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senutyenool



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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2002 8:09 pm    Post subject:
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Mage, shmage. As a bounty hunter there only use I can see them for is to locate the target, something like a whitepages or referdex (?) <g>

Now, go on, shoo, get outta tha trackers area, nothing here for you Wink

::mutters something about having to hide the Trackers entrance a bit better::
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